[00:00:00] Suze Orman: Do you know that over 50% of the people in the United States have less than $400 to their name? That is it. You have to understand that the goal of money is for you to be secure. So all of you should stop and answer that question. Are you secure? And if you are not secure, why not? Whatever hand you're dealt, whether you were raised by parents who were good to you or abused, you had money, didn't have money, were drug addicts, whatever it may be. There is not an excuse large enough in this world to keep any of you from being who you are meant to be.

[00:00:50] If you really wanna have a lot of money 30, 40 years from now, you have got to.

[00:00:59] Hala Taha: What's up? [00:01:00] YAP fam. It's your host, Hala Taha, and you are listening to YAP Young and Profiting Podcast, the number one education podcast and business podcast across all apps. Where we interview the brightest minds in the world and unpack their wisdom into actionable advice that you can use in your daily life.

[00:01:16] Thanks for tuning in and get ready to listen, learn and profit.

[00:01:31] Suze! Welcome to Young and Profiting Podcast. 

[00:01:35] Suze Orman: Thank you, my dear Hala. 

[00:01:36] Let's talk money.

[00:01:38] Hala Taha: I am so excited for today. I've been watching you on TV since I was a little girl, and my parents would always listen to you. And in fact, out of all the people I've had on the show, think Matthew McConaughey, Deepak Chopra.

[00:01:51] My mom was by far the most impressed with you when I told her you were coming on the show. She nearly broke down in tears. It was really full circle for her. Super happy to have [00:02:00] you on.

[00:02:01] Suze Orman: I'm glad I could do something for you. Hi Hala's mama. 

[00:02:04] Hala Taha: I love it. And all jokes aside, today is really gonna be an instant classic on Young and Profiting Podcast because we are joined by one of the top personal finance experts in the world, Suze Orman.

[00:02:15] Suze is the author of several New York Times bestsellers. She's a two-time Emmy award-winning television host, as well as the host of the super popular Women and Money podcast. And on top of all of this. Suze is the co-founder of Secure Save, which helps employers build emergency saving accounts for their employees.

[00:02:33] And the thing that I love most about Suze is that she gives back. She's helped so many people. For example, she's served as the official personal finance educator for the United States Army and Army Reserve, and she's also been a special advocate for the national domestic violence hotline. On today's episode, we're gonna learn how Suze overcame obstacles in her childhood and her young adult life to ultimately become the hands down. Most recognized financial expert in America.

[00:02:59] And then [00:03:00] we'll get into some more tactical advice with Suze namely, how to navigate our finances and saving post pandemic and where to best invest our money right now. And time permitting will also touch on credit card debt, student loans, and the housing market and retirement as well. So Suze, let's get started cuz we've got a lot to cover.

[00:03:17] And I do wanna spend a decent amount of time on your come up story because there's so many lessons there for us to unpack. So today you're well-known for your voice, your personality, and your strong expertise in finance, even a household name for literally decades now. However, you weren't always this confident or competent with your finances or your voice.

[00:03:37] So I wanna take it back to your childhood. You had a speech impediment in elementary school that left you feeling insecure and this learning disability impacted your ability to read and haunted you through high school and college. Can you walk us through your early life and the setbacks you faced with your speech impediment and take us all the way to how you ultimately dropped out of college and traveled cross country and you can take your time.

[00:03:58] I know it's a long story, but I want everybody [00:04:00] to hear it. 

[00:04:00] Suze Orman: It goes way back. I was born in 1951, so I'll let you figure out everybody how old that makes me. It makes me 71 just in case you're not good with numbers. But way back then, they used to give everybody reading tests to see how smart you were.

[00:04:20] I grew up on the south side of Chicago and I was given a reading exam and I scored the lowest out of everybody in the class. So there were my best friends, Andy, Mimi, and Leslie sitting in the first row. The first three seats, because they sat you according to your reading exam scores. So there were my best friends in the first row, the first three seats, and there was little Suze Orman in the last row in the last seat.

[00:04:53] And one of the reasons that I couldn't read very well is I did have a speech impediment. So [00:05:00] words such as beautiful came out as buk. I could not pronounce my Rs, S's, or Ts. And because I couldn't speak very well, I didn't wanna read at all. I was dyslexic. I'm sure I'm still dyslexic to this day.

[00:05:15] So it was all stacked against me, back then. There was no understanding of it whatsoever. So sitting in that last seat, in that last role showed everybody how stupid I was. Hala I knew I was dumb. I knew I would never amount to anything because of that. So why should I even try? So all through grammar school, through high school, even through college. I always knew that I would never be anything really other than probably a waitress because my parents didn't have a lot of money.

[00:05:52] My mother was a secretary, sold Avon on the side. My father was caught in a fire in [00:06:00] this little chicken shack that he had, and he had third degree burns all over his body, gave him emphysema. Spent most of his life in the hospital. So the kids, my two brothers and myself, when he was able to open another little place, we would have to run it for him.

[00:06:18] So I knew that the only thing that I was good at was waitressing. So all through college, I didn't care about college. My roommate in college was a man by the name of John Belushi and the reason that he was my roommate, if any of you even know him anymore, he was the Blues Brothers. He was a stable on Saturday Night Live.

[00:06:41] He was very famous later on. But my roommate was a woman by the name of Judy Jacqueline, who ended up marrying John Belushi. And because we didn't have the money to live in a dorm at the University of Illinois. They gave us permission to live [00:07:00] off campus where three of us, Carol, Judy, and myself, shared a one bedroom apartment for, I think it was $120 a month for all of us.

[00:07:09] And with Judy came, John. So I'll let you imagine what my college years were like with John and Judy, but didn't matter to me. Because I knew that I would never be more than just a waitress, cuz that's what I did. I worked my way through college, working as a waitress at Bobbys and Sadie's Deli during the day and at night till two o'clock in the morning at the Red Lion Inn.

[00:07:40] And that's all I did. So I don't think I ever got a grade above a C. Four years after going to the University of Illinois, I thought, I don't have a language requirement. I don't have what it takes to do what I need to do to graduate. So I got in a van in nine, this was [00:08:00] 1973. Now my girlfriend Lori, and I got into a van that my brother lent me $1,500 to buy.

[00:08:07] And we headed out to California to find our fortune. We ended up living in the van. On the streets for a number of months until I landed a job as a waitress at the Buttercup Bakery. And I was a waitress from the age of 23 till 30, making $400 a month. So here I am, but all my ideas that I've given, the people that own this place were fabulous.

[00:08:41] And now they're expanding from this little tiny place on the corner of Alcatraz, and I even forget the other name in College Avenue to owning half the block on my ideas. So I'm thinking I can open up my own restaurant. Look what I did for [00:09:00] them. I can be more than just a waitress. Not that there's anything wrong with being a waitress.

[00:09:05] So I called up my mom and my dad. This is now 1979, 1980, and I asked them for $20,000. To open up my own restaurant. And they said to me, Suze, where are we going to get $20,000? That's more money than we have to our entire name. And I knew that, and I felt so bad because every parent or most parents, they wanna help their kids.

[00:09:34] So I apologize to my mom. And the next day I went into work and a man by the name of Fred Hasbrook, who I've been waiting on for over seven years, came in and he said, what's wrong? Sunshine, you don't look happy. And I told Fred the story and he looked and he went, oh. He went and sat down with all these people that I've been waiting [00:10:00] on all those years.

[00:10:02] And about an half hour later, he comes up to the counter where I'm standing, and in front of me, he puts. All these checks and crumbled piece of paper that I'm now opening and their commitments and checks totalling $50,000. And with it is a little note written on a napkin that says, this is for people like you to have your dreams come true, to be paid back in 10 years with no interest if you can.

[00:10:38] He obviously had talked to all those people and they either gave me a commitment and then sent in the check or gave it to me the next day. And it was all the people who wanted to help me. And I was like, oh my God. And I looked at Fred and I said, are these checks gonna bounce like all mine do? And he said, no, Suze.

[00:10:59] I [00:11:00] said what do I do with this kind of money, Fred? I've never seen this kind of money in my life. And he told me to take it down to the local brokerage firm, Merrill Lynch at the time, and open up a money market account. And I said to Fred, what's a Merrill Lynch and what's a money market account?

[00:11:19] He told me, I went the next day to Merrill Lynch and I was brand new obviously. And there's something in brokerage firms, you should all know this, I'm sure it's still this way today. That's called the broker of the day. And that's the person that no matter who walks in that door that day, you are their client.

[00:11:42] And Randy, who, I even forget his last name now, he was the one who greeted me. So I sat down with Randy, told him my story. How I didn't have any money. I had to keep this safe and sound cuz this was my money for me to open up a [00:12:00] restaurant. And Randy said to me, how would you like to make a quick hundred dollars a week?

[00:12:06] I said, Randy, are you kidding me? That's more than I make as a waitress. And he said, just sign here on the bottom line. There are all these papers, all blank. I signed, I then left. After I left. Randy filled out all the papers to make it look like I was a sophisticated investor. And he qualified me for playing the options market because you are not allowed at a brokerage firm to invest in options. Especially buying options because 90% of the people who buy options lose all their money.

[00:12:51] So to be able to do you have to qualify and have money that you can lose. Everything that Randy wrote on that [00:13:00] paperwork was a lie to qualify me to be able to buy options. Why did Randy wanna do that? Because at that time anyway, options was one of the highest commission ticket items out there. To make a very long story short, within three months, all $50,000 was lost.

[00:13:26] Now, I didn't know what to do because the people, Hala who gave me that money. They didn't have a lot of money. Fred was a salesman who sold little tape recorders. He himself gave me $2,000, which was probably all of his savings account that he had. So I was like, I gotta pay these people back. And I thought, I know I can be a broker.

[00:13:52] They just make you broker because during those three months when Randy was buying and [00:14:00] selling options, I was learning about what he was doing. I was watching Wall Street Week on PBS. I was buying Baron's Magazine, getting the Wall Street Journal. This was really before computers and my bedroom. I had tacked up the Wall Street Journal, the stock pages and the option pages, and I very well started to learn everything you needed to know about options.

[00:14:29] And I already knew two months into it, we had lost all of the money. So I get dressed to go to Merrill Lynch now for an interview, and I put on my red and white striped Sassoon pants tucked into my white cowboy boots with a blue silk shirt. I thought I looked fabulous. It was the best outfit I had. It's all I had.

[00:14:55] I go to Merrill Lynch to apply for a job. Now, there [00:15:00] were five brokers that needed to interview you, to recommend you to the manager if they should hire you or not. Each one of them freaked out. They had no idea what to do with me. So all of a sudden I'm immediately in the manager's office. His name was Peter San.

[00:15:19] And Peter looks at me and he says, Suze, I personally believe women belong barefoot and pregnant. However, and this was because there were no women working at Merrill Lynch at the time as a financial advisor. He had 105 male brokers, no women, 1980 affirmative action. Took me two seconds to put that together.

[00:15:47] And he says to me, I have to hire you, but I want you to know now I am going to fire you in six months. I say to him, [00:16:00] how much are you going to pay me to get me pregnant? He says to me, $1,500 a month. I knew that $1,500 a month times six was $9,000. It would've taken me two, two and a half years to earn that at the Buttercup Bakery.

[00:16:21] I loved being a waitress. I didn't wanna be a stockbroker. I had to do something to pay these people back, but that's not what I wanted to do. And before I know it, he hires me. I'm sent away with a book, How to Dress for Success. They then tell me to go to Macy's in San Francisco. And open up a charge account there and they'll approve it if Macy's just calls them so that I can buy some decent clothes.

[00:16:53] I charge up $3,000 of clothes. I am now scared to death [00:17:00] because I don't belong with all these fancy schmanzy brokers that are driving Mercedes, BMWs. I was driving in 1980, a 1967 Volvo station wagon while all of these brokers parked in the parking lot, which was $80 a month. I parked on the streets to get tickets so that I could go to the court and do community service on weekends cuz I couldn't afford $80 a month.

[00:17:32] So here I am now, scared to death and I don't know how I'm gonna get through this cuz I know I don't belong there. I can feel it. Number one, I'm a lesbian. Number two, I am a woman. Number three, I know absolutely nothing about money, nothing. So that's when I [00:18:00] decided I needed to create a new truth to get me over my greatest fear.

[00:18:06] So I created a truth that went like this. I am young, powerful, and successful, producing at least $10,000 a month. Now I was 30 years of age, not so young, powerful, I don't think so. I couldn't have been more powerless if I tried. Successful, no way. And producing and making $10,000 a month. Are you kidding me?

[00:18:37] But I said at least, cuz I decided, If the powers that be wanted me to make more than $10,000 a month, why limit myself? I said it silently to myself 25 times a day looking in the mirror before I went to bed at night. When I woke up on the way to Merrill Lynch, I screamed [00:19:00] it out loud 25 times. I wrote it 25 times, and I did that every single day.

[00:19:09] I wish I had kept that journal that I wrote in. I did that every day for six months. Before you knew it, I was making far more than $10,000 a month. However, while I'm working for Merrill Lynch, I'm realizing that what my broker did was illegal. There's a no year customer rule, which states you cannot invest somebody's money inappropriately for them if they can't afford to lose it.

[00:19:43] You have to keep it safe and sound. I go in to Peter's office and I say, Peter, you have a crook that's working for you. Peter says to me, Suze, that crook makes us a lot of money. You go and you sit in your little [00:20:00] cubicle and don't you say a word. I'm sitting in this tiny little cubicle watching Randy in this glass office as one client after another goes in there, and I'm thinking to myself, Suze Orman, the people that gave you that money said you didn't have to pay them back.

[00:20:24] I had 10 years to do so if I could, but what if it was my mom or my dad? Or Hala even your mom or your grandmother or whoever. And that was everything that they had to their name. So it would've been easy for me to say nothing, but it would not have been right. So the head of operations was also gay, and I was talking to him about what happened, and he said to [00:21:00] me, Suze, I'll be leaving at five o'clock today.

[00:21:05] You can go into my office. And on the left hand side, there's a drawer. Why don't you open it and look in there? My secretary knows that you have permission to come in my office. And then he leaves. And I'm like, what the heck is this man talking about? But we had this affinity. Back then because even though the gay liberation movement was out there, it was still very difficult to be gay.

[00:21:35] It's starting to be very difficult again, everybody. To be anything other than what the majority now is feeling like is normal. That is another story and another podcast. So I go in there and I open this drawer and you can tell that there's little stickers on the top of all these files, [00:22:00] and the front was will win.

[00:22:02] In the back, is we'll lose, will lose. And I opened up the once that said, will lose, and I go, what is he going to lose? And they were all lawsuits against Merrill Lynch. Many against Randy as well. And it was from the same lawyer. Everyone that was Will lose was from the same lawyer, and I lo I'm going, he's telling me to call this lawyer, and the lawyer's phone number was in every single file.

[00:22:38] I call the lawyer, tell him the story. He says, I'll take it on contingency, which means whatever I win, he gets 30%. But if we lose, I don't have to pay him anything. Again, to make a long story short, I sue Merrill Lynch while I'm working for them. What I [00:23:00] did not know is because I sued them, they could not fire me.

[00:23:05] It took two years for that lawsuit to come to court. Within those two years, number one, Randy was fired and I became their number six producing broker. So now all of a sudden I'm very valuable to them. Peter is out, a new manager is in, I meet with him and he says, Suze, it's obvious what happened here. We would like to settle with you.

[00:23:38] He gave me all the money back, all $50,000 plus 18% interest, plus he paid the contingency to the lawyer so that I could give all the people back their money. 18% was because back then in the eighties, [00:24:00] money market accounts were paying 21, 22%. Everything was off the roof. A mortgage was 16% back then, so it was the normal interest rate in money market accounts.

[00:24:13] So I was able to pay everybody back. Now I expected when Fred got his money back, plus 18% interest, I would've heard from him. It's now 1982, 83, and I don't hear from him. In 1984, I finally get an email, not an email, a letter from him that says to me, Suze, words don't come as easily to me as they once did, Fred had a stroke and he had just learned again how to speak and how to write, and he said to me in this letter, who could ever invest in a porcelain blue eye counter girl and watch her become one of the more [00:25:00] successful financial advisors to be?

[00:25:04] Cuz I was doing very well by this time and I had already left Merrill Lynch. I was now at Prudential Base as a vice president for them. And I had gained the reputation as the nation's expert in a certain type of an investment. And I was on radio shows and everything like that. A year or two later, Fred died.

[00:25:28] His family called me to let me know, and I was talking to his son and I said, is there any way I can help? And he said, yeah, my mom doesn't know what to do. She's at a loss. So I was able to help Fred's wife and make sure everything was okay. Aw. That is how I started in the financial arena. That is why to this day, I am the advocate for those [00:26:00] who don't have money.

[00:26:01] I am the advocate for those who wanna be more so they can have more. I am the advocate so that they understand they are not to ever be taken by a financial advisor, but they need to know what is right, what is wrong, and that is how I became who I am to this day. 

[00:26:24] Hala Taha: Let's hold that thought and take a quick break with our sponsors.

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[00:30:55] Wow, this is so inspiring. young and profiteers at 30 years [00:31:00] old, Suze made a career change. She dominated her field. She is one of the most well known and looked at people in the finance world. She's positively impacted millions of people. And so many of you listening, you are 30 years old, or you're in your thirties.

[00:31:14] A lot of you guys are scared to make a career change, and I hope this inspires you to realize that it's never too late to get started on your dream life. And Suze, you talked about affirmations and how you changed the way that you thought. I would love to understand 29, 30 years old when you got that idea to actually start your own business.

[00:31:33] Before that, you had a pretty limited mindset, right? You thought you could only be a waitress and you had a very unglamorous life. But that one decision of I wanna be an entrepreneur, I think really set everything off because a lot of people who you had served believed in, you probably saw what you didn't even see in yourself.

[00:31:53] And so I'd love to understand what do you think happened that was that spark where you were like, you know what? I'm more than [00:32:00] just a waitress. I can do this. 

[00:32:02] Suze Orman: I was desperate. When it comes to money, you usually don't do the right thing until you become desperate. You continue to pay things with a credit card and live far beyond your means.

[00:32:16] Using up any means you can to get what you want, even though you don't need what you want until the date comes. When your credit cards are maxed out, you've borrowed all the money. Possibly you can from a retirement account, you have no place to go and you know you can't pay your rent or your mortgage and you are in trouble.

[00:32:37] When you hit rock bottom, financially speaking, that's when change happens. As long as you have an out of some kind. You refuse to face the truth about your situation. My rock bottom was all these people that believed in me, they wanted [00:33:00] to help me. I needed to pay them back. I couldn't turn my back on them.

[00:33:06] We turn our backs on ourself all the times, all the time. We do things that aren't good for us. We eat things that aren't healthy. We spend money. We don't have to impress people we don't even know or we don't save as much for retirement as we should. We always tell ourselves this thing, I could work.

[00:33:26] I don't have to put money away now. I have years left to do I'm 25, I'm 30. What difference does it make right now if I start putting money away? Suze Orman makes all the difference in the world. People, that will be the biggest mistake all of you make if you don't start while you are young. So when it comes to ourselves, especially women, we give to everybody before we give to ourselves.

[00:33:52] You will put your family, your friends, your pets, your plants, your employees, your [00:34:00] employers, everybody in front of you. Women have the ability to give birth. We nourish that which we give birth to. So by nature, whether you've ever done it or not, it is our nature to give. We give more to others than we give to ourselves Until we are 50, 60, 70 years of age, all of a sudden you're not in the relationship that you thought was the most magnificent thing of your life, and now you have to start all over again.

[00:34:37] So it is really important that you don't make that mistake. So here I was and I needed to help others give back to others. I wasn't thinking of me. I wasn't thinking about how can Suze Orman become the world's personal finance expert? Wasn't thinking about that at all. I [00:35:00] thought, I'm just gonna go back and be a waitress again.

[00:35:02] I can settle. I loved that. But I have to make sure that I pay other people back. That was my incentive. 

[00:35:13] Hala Taha: What an inspiring story. I love that so much. And I also loved you saying how you did these affirmations and really retrained your mind in terms of your confidence and how you showed up to the world.

[00:35:24] And I'm sure that really impacted you as well in terms of how well you did in finance. Yeah. Yeah. And it seems like you obviously fell in love with that career. Do you feel like your speech impediment and your, the fact that you weren't so good at language and reading made you better at finance and math and this kind of stuff?

[00:35:43] Suze Orman: I think it made me better at everything. Once, I'll never forget that I was sitting on the stage with Oprah. I did the Oprah show for 30 some odd times over all the years. And I said Oprah before the show started. I said, do you know that I have written [00:36:00] more New York Times bestsellers number one, New York Times bestsellers, the books that I've read?

[00:36:06] And she said, let's not tell anybody that. And I'm like, why not? I want people to know that anything is possible. She said, do me a favor. Let's just not for right now. All right, Suze. I said, okay, whatever. But because I didn't read, because all I had was my own voice, I didn't have other voices in my head. I didn't have anybody else's ideas that are gotten from books in my head.

[00:36:40] All I had was my own voice, what I believed in and how I said things. And because I said things in normal language, I didn't know how to speak finance. I only knew how to speak, what they call Suze speak. [00:37:00] I only knew how to be me. And throughout my entire career, whether it was at Prudential Base or Merrill Lynch, I only knew how to be me and stand up for myself.

[00:37:15] And that happened because I had to do that growing up all the time, and that did it. So I will forever believe that whatever hand you're dealt, whatever situation that you're in, whether you were raised by parents who were good to you or abused, you had money, didn't have money, were drug addicts, whatever it may be, there is not an excuse large enough in this world to keep any of you from being who you are meant to be.

[00:37:52] Not one excuse, and you have got to believe that everything happens for the best. Even when I was telling you [00:38:00] the story you said, when I said I lost all $50,000, you went, oh, because I lost $50,000. That is who I am to this day. If that hadn't happened, I wouldn't be who I am. I would've opened up a restaurant.

[00:38:19] So you have to know that everything happens for the best and take it that way. So when one door closes, another one opens, you may think you know what you wanna be, you can try it. If it doesn't work out, that's not what you were meant to be. But there is something out there all of you are meant to be. But if you do something just to make money, If you do something just to be famous, if you write a book just to be a number one New York Times bestseller, I got news for you.

[00:38:55] Your intentions are 10000% wrong. [00:39:00] Do things cuz they will help others do things cuz you love helping others do things because you know what you wanna do will make this world a better place. That's why you do what you do. Otherwise, it will never work in a million years. 

[00:39:19] Hala Taha: Amen to that. Suze, thank you so much.

[00:39:22] I love that little rant that you went on. So let's talk about some more practical financial advice. We just talked about how you ended up losing, 50 grand in a money market account when the market turned. And so I think it's a great segue into some practical guidance on today's economic condition.

[00:39:40] The market recently faced a downturn, right? Inflation is going up. Ukraine and Russia's situation, A lot of people are saying, we are gonna have a recession before the end of the year. You are the expert, obviously. So you tell me, what do you think the economy is like right now and what do we have to look forward to in the coming months and years?

[00:39:59] Suze Orman: [00:40:00] Yeah, it depends who you are because there are many people, probably 50% of the population in the United States are already in their own recession. They're already in a situation where they cannot afford food, they cannot afford rent, they cannot afford anything. They're going into whatever little retirement account they may have.

[00:40:24] None of 'em have emergency savings plans. Do you know that over 50% of the people in the United States have less than $400 to their name? Yikes. That is it. That is all they have. So depending on who you are and your financial situation, will a recession hurt you? Will it not? Will a recession hurt me and kt it will not?

[00:40:52] Will anything financially? Markets going up, markets going down. Will that hurt me? Financially, it will not. [00:41:00] So no matter what happens out there, I am 100% financially secure. But the question is, are you have to understand that the goal of money is for you to be secure. So all of you should stop right here and right now and answer that question.

[00:41:19] Are you secure? And if you are not secure, why not? And most of you will say, all I have is credit card debt. I have student loan. I don't know what to do. And so therefore, you want to change your lives. What you have to understand about money more even important than should you do this? Should you do that?

[00:41:44] What should you do? Because what I've learned over these past 40 years, longer than most of you have been alive, or at least many of you, what I have learned is this, that you [00:42:00] and your money are one. You are the one who goes out and earns a paycheck, opens up a business, creates an idea, brings in money for it.

[00:42:10] You are the one who decides what to do with that money. Do you save it? Do you spend it? Do you reinvest it? What do you do with it? Money cannot do anything without you. So given that's true, there is a major law of money that power attracts money. Powerlessness repels it. When you are powerless, you repel people.

[00:42:39] If you think about it, people control money. Didn't I just say money? Can't do anything without you. Your $20 or your credit card cannot get up and go to the store and buy things. You have to do it. When you are powerless in life, for whatever [00:43:00] reasons. Have you ever noticed you repel people, you just broke up with somebody or they broke up with you.

[00:43:06] You've gained 30 pounds after you just lost 40 or whatever it may be. If you repel people, therefore you repel money cuz it is people that will be your customers, it will be people that hire you, that promote you, decide what to pay you. When you are powerful in life. Powerful, you attract people. People control money.

[00:43:34] So when you are powerful, you attract money. What makes you more powerless than anything else? And that is debt. Debt is bondage. You will never be powerful if you have debt. And I'm not talking about debt such as mortgage debt and things like that, which is good debt. I'm talking about credit card debt.

[00:43:59] When you have [00:44:00] credit card debt and it's mounting and interest rates are going up and up, you have rendered yourself powerless. And people can feel that everybody. So I often wondered why when I was a financial advisor seeing clients, why was it that I would give people the most exquisite financial advice and six months later they'd come back and they didn't follow it?

[00:44:29] There's something in every single one of us that prevents us from doing that, which we know we should do when it comes to money. I wrote a book called The Nine Steps to Financial Freedom. I have a course called The Nine Steps to Financial Independence. Cuz over all these years I thought the goal was financial freedom.

[00:44:52] It is not. That's when I started to learn about billionaires and they were totally dependent on crooked financial [00:45:00] advisors. In many cases, not all. And before you knew it, they lost money. Financial independence is when you are not dependent on anybody. You have financial freedom, but you also know exactly what to do with your money, why you should do it, and you know about it.

[00:45:17] So now you're independent cuz the last thing you wanna do is be dependent upon somebody and render yourself powerless. So after I started with the book and the course, that book in 1997 went on to be the number one selling book of all books for Random House in Random Houses 50 year career. Why? Because it was in that book that I was able to discover working with clients, and then I talked about in the book what keeps us from doing that, which we know we should do with money.

[00:45:58] And again, [00:46:00] we could do a three hour podcast here. But the main thing all of you need to know is that fear, shame, and anger are the three internal obstacles to wealth. You have to know that your emotions rule what you do. And since you and your money are one, you have to be very careful. There's so many things to all of this really.

[00:46:25] So given that you have control over your emotions, given that you do what I'm about to tell you to do when it comes to money or not, then you will seriously prosper. But the main thing I would tell you if you're younger, which most of you are, is rather than being freaked out that these markets are going down, although over this past week or two, the markets have been going up big time, and I'm sure many of you are so happy about that.

[00:46:59] What is [00:47:00] wrong with all of you? At the age of 30, 40, you are not day traders. You're not buying and selling. And if you are, you're making the biggest mistake out there. You are investing for your future. You want your money to compound for you. The longer it's invested, and the more that money makes, the more money you will have.

[00:47:24] When these markets were going down and down, they were all the things you wanted to buy. Were on sale. Now, I'm not saying that you should buy Microsoft or any of those things. Microsoft at the recording of this podcast was found 30%. Today it's at a hundred dollars. Microsoft, these stocks, that may be the future

[00:47:48] again, one day are on serious sale. What do you wanna do? Buy Microsoft when it's at three, four, $500. Amazon. Really everybody. So [00:48:00] your goal is to invest in a retirement account, preferably if you're not making any money, you want a Roth IRA. You want a Roth 401(k), a Roth 403 , which are retirement vehicles where you are investing with after tax money.

[00:48:20] Can you just forget the tax write off If you're not making that much money right now, and even if you are and if you qualify for a Roth IRA, oh my God, you put money in there. You do it every single month. If you don't know what to buy, just do a good exchange traded fund like the Vanguard Standard and Forex 500, you know the Vanguard Total Stock Market Index Fund or the Standard Forex 500 Index Fund, or whatever it may be.

[00:48:50] Get yourself diversification. Do it month in and month out and years from now. Oh my God. The biggest mistake you will [00:49:00] make is waiting until you're older to fund your retirement. Do you want me to give them an example of that? 

[00:49:08] Hala Taha: Yeah, I would love that. 

[00:49:09] Suze Orman: All right. 

[00:49:09] Hala Taha: Of course. 

[00:49:10] Suze Orman: Let's just say you're 20. You have 20 year olds listening to you.

[00:49:15] Hala Taha: Yes. 

[00:49:16] Suze Orman: Yeah. All right. 20. And let's just say you open up a Roth IRA and you would do it, and any discount brokerage firm out there, I don't care which one you use, whether it's Fidelity, Schwab, Vanguard, whatever, and you put just a hundred dollars a month starting at the age of 20 into this account. And let's just say you do that every single year until you are 60.

[00:49:49] So for 40 years, and let's say over those 40 years, Your money earns an average annual rate of return, just let's say of [00:50:00] 12%, cuz over the past 10 or some years before this year, you could have gotten 14% easily over the past those 10 years. This, let's say it's 12% annual average rate of return. One year it's up.

[00:50:14] One year it's down. But overall, those years, that's what you've averaged. Do you know 40 years from now you would've $1 million in that account? But you say, Suze, what difference can a hundred dollars a month make that's $1,200 a year? What if I started at 30, that's only $12,000, so I'll put a hundred dollars a month starting in at 30.

[00:50:41] What would you have 30 years from then? You'd have only $300,000 those 10 years. Cost you $700,000 at [00:51:00] just a hundred dollars a month and you think you have time to postpone. Time is the greatest ingredient for any financial independence recipe. Bar none. 

[00:51:13] Hala Taha: This is so interesting cuz I thought you were gonna say to hold off on stocks and stuff like the s and p 500 and I thought you were gonna recommend to put our money in bonds.

[00:51:23] Suze Orman: No, you obviously are listening to the Women and Money Podcast and the stop heading to that is, and everybody smart enough to listen. So it's really not just for women and money, but the majority of people that listen, cuz I've had a following for all these years, are women who are 60, 70, 80, and 90 years of age.

[00:51:47] And you come to a place in your life where you need to keep your money safe and sound, and how do you make money now that you may need in a few years without [00:52:00] risking money? That's when, and you still, by the way, no matter what age you are, you still have the ability to do a series I bond right now, which is paying 9.62% annualized, and you can invest anywhere from $25 all the way up to $10,000 treasury direct.gov.

[00:52:21] If you don't know about Series I bond, you should all be listening to my podcast. The April 17th version is a masterclass on them. Greatest investment you will ever make, bar none, but you have to leave your money in there for at least one year. So for my audience, at this point in time, that's what I would tell them to do for 20 year olds.

[00:52:45] 30 year old, 40 year olds, I would be dollar cost averaging into these markets via a retirement account every single month. When months go up, [00:53:00] months go down, and no matter what, over time you will dollar cost average, that means you will average the price of what you're buying with your dollars. So when something goes down, you get to buy more shares.

[00:53:15] When it goes up, you get to buy less shares, but over time you watch what happens to your money. 

[00:53:24] Hala Taha: Yeah, good advice. And it makes sense because we're not gonna pull out our money in, 30, 40 years. So even if the economy goes down for the next two years, in the next few years it will go up and we get to buy everything on sale, like you said. So makes total sense. 

[00:53:40] We'll be right back after a quick break from our sponsors. This episode of YAP is brought to you by The Jordan Harbinger Show. You guys may know that Jordan Harbinger is my all-time favorite podcaster. So much so that I've willed him to become my podcast mentor and we now talk every single day.

[00:53:57] In fact, he's in my Slack channel. The Jordan [00:54:00] Harbinger show is the absolute best show for young and profiteers to add to their rotation. This is the only show I really recommend. The Jordan Harbinger show was named Best of Apple 2018, and is aimed at making you a more informed, more critical thinker. And in each episode, Jordan unpacks his guest wisdom into practical nuggets that you can then use to improve your life.

[00:54:20] It's very similar to YAP in terms that there's no fluff and you always walk away learning something. And he also has a bit of humor, which is a really nice touch. Jordan being the OG that he is always snags the absolute best guest like Mark Cuban, rapper T.I, athletes, like the late great Kobe Bryant, Dennis Rodman.

[00:54:41] He is also super picky with his guests like me. So the topics are always extremely interesting. Even if the guest is not well known. Jordan has great research. He asks amazing questions. He's a natural interviewer, and his topics are always entertaining. It's no wonder Jordan is literally one of the biggest [00:55:00] podcasters in the world.

[00:55:00] And Jordan, I'm coming for your neck. Just kidding. You guys know that I'm a fan of Jordan, and if that's not worth checking out, I'm not sure what is. Go check out the Jordan Herbinger show on your favorite podcast platform. That's the Jordan Herbinger show, H-A-R-B-(as in boy)-I-N-(as in nancy)-G-E-R) on Apple Podcast, Spotify, or wherever you listen to your podcast.

[00:55:23] This episode of YAP is brought to you by Rocket Money. Guys, years ago when I was getting my MBA, we were tasked to write a fictitious business plan, and I got the bright idea to create an app that would allow you to see and manage all of your subscriptions in one place. Because to be honest, I was being selfish and trying to solve my own problem because I am the absolute worst at forgetting to cancel my subscriptions.

[00:55:45] I swear at all times I probably have 300 to maybe even $500 of monthly subscriptions that I do not use, and I'm ashamed to say it. I never get around to canceling them. I subscribe to things way too easy. I'm careless with it and I know I [00:56:00] have a problem. Now, I never got around to actually creating that app after writing my business plan.

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[00:56:45] I just can't believe I never signed up to Rocket Money in the past because it's such an easy way to get my charges in order. This nonsense of paying for subscriptions I don't use has gone on for so long, far too long. My New Year's Young and profiting resolution is [00:57:00] to use Rocket money to clean out my subscriptions.

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[00:57:44] I love to multitask. And it's usually all fine and dandy, except when I buy meat from my typical online grocery store, it's always so frustrating. Like for example, one time I had plans to make a romantic steak dinner with my boyfriend and the grocery store [00:58:00] sent me beef stew meat instead. And Stew is not sexy yet.

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[00:59:34] So let's talk about saving, because as we get into this recession, I think a lot of my young and profiteers are relatively successful. They have corporate jobs, they're entrepreneurs. How much money should they be saving during a recession? 

[00:59:47] Suze Orman: Listen, recession, no recession, you should all have, at least in my opinion, eight months to one year of a savings account.

[00:59:58] You lose your job, you [01:00:00] get ill, you can't work. We experience 2008, 2009 all over again. We have a pandemic again, but that this time the government is too broke to finance all of you, and you still have all these bills. How are you going to pay them? Every single person needs, in my opinion, eight to 12 months of expenses that have to be paid.

[01:00:27] Your rent, your phone, your insurance, your car payment, your student loan payment, whatever it may be, you need that. Now, you may find that's a lot of money, but if you just start seriously. $500 is better than $100. A thousand dollars is better than $500. You can do this and you should. 

[01:00:52] Hala Taha: Yeah, so one of the reasons why I started this podcast, I actually started it as a side hustle four and a half years ago, and then I launched a social media and [01:01:00] podcast agency.

[01:01:00] Two years later, we're 5 million in revenue, 60 employees around the world, and it's been to my benefit to start a side hustle, and I always talk about helping people earn more money. That is my goal, is to help all of my listeners earn more money because I feel like that's the best way to have financial freedom.

[01:01:18] You can save all you want, but I feel like it's more impactful in my opinion, to try to earn as much money as you can. And so I thought you might like this. This guy's coming up on my show. His name is Alex Hormozi you may have heard of him. He is really starting to bubble up right now and he talks about investing in the SM ME 500 and what his point is to invest in skill.

[01:01:41] That will enable you to get a second job or enable you to make more money in this part of your life. You're 20 to 50 years old where you really need to earn your money so you can save for the future. Because when you're older, hopefully you're not working as hard, right? So I'd love to hear your insight on investing in education right [01:02:00] now and getting new skills so you can actually make more money.

[01:02:04] Suze Orman: I don't have a problem with that. However, you cannot be 100% just spending what you earn if you spend what you earn and you do not have where you are investing in a retirement account. Now, I'm not saying you gotta put a lot of money in there, but you have to put something in there, something in an emergency account.

[01:02:27] You are gonna find yourself in trouble. And the reason is this, may you all be protected forever against a car accident in illness. Being shot on the streets, being someplace that you shouldn't have been, even though it's where you walked every day and something happens. Things happen in life. Everybody I'm going to get for the next 20 years, the ability to do an S and me fund, I'm gonna put [01:03:00] everything into educating myself, making sure that I'm the greatest that can be.

[01:03:05] I'm the most educated, I have the most skills. You should do that. But on the other hand, you also have to prepare in case something goes wrong. , something goes wrong, you get older and they tell you're a woman. You have breast cancer in your thirties and forties. You get ms, you get covid. And Covid comes back and it's now long haul covid and you can't work.

[01:03:33] We have always lived in a time. Where you have to be laser focused to succeed, but the biggest mistake you will make in my opinion, is to just go for you and making more. I don't have a problem with that, but you have to do something with the more that you're making that is also safe and sound in case [01:04:00] something goes wrong.

[01:04:02] You have to have a plan A and a plan B. 

[01:04:06] Hala Taha: I love that advice. It's great advice. Let's say you're 30 years old, which is probably the average age of all my listeners. You're 30 years old, you've been working at corporate for seven years. You have a hundred thousand dollars saved. You've got a 401K from your employer.

[01:04:22] You've got a hundred thousand dollars in cash right now in the bank. What would you suggest that we do with that? 

[01:04:28] Suze Orman: Yeah, it depends on their situation. Do they own a home? Do they have any credit card debt? What was the goal of that a hundred thousand dollars was that goal there so that you can quit your corporate job to start another entity and that is the a hundred thousand dollars that's going to get you buy for the year or two that you need to start up something that you really wanna do.

[01:04:59] Cuz maybe you [01:05:00] don't want the corporate job anymore. Maybe you don't wanna have to suck up to people that aren't as smart as you. I can't answer that question unless you tell me. What does this person wanna do with their life? 

[01:05:12] Hala Taha: Let's say they wanna continue on with corporate for more years and they just don't know where to put this a hundred thousand dollars. They've saved it. Maybe they took their money outta stocks during Covid cuz they got scared and now they're sitting on this cash. A lot of people actually have this problem where they're sitting on cash because they don't know where to put it and they're scared. 

[01:05:30] Suze Orman: Yeah. So fear, shame, and anger.

[01:05:34] The three main internal obstacles to wealth. If you invest in the market when you are afraid, you will buy at the wrong time and you will sell at the wrong time. So if you are afraid of this stock market, it does not matter what anybody tells you. This is your money. And what happens to your money directly affects your life.

[01:05:57] Not a financial advisor's life, not an [01:06:00] insurance agent's life. Your life. So let's just say you are afraid. Now you have alternatives out there. Right now I would so be investing in a series I bond maximum. You can put in $10,000 right now in an individual account, $10,000 in a trust account, $10,000 in a business account.

[01:06:23] If you are with a partner, a spouse, whatever, I would be doing the same with them. One of the best investments out there right now, bar none you need to know about them. Next, I would absolutely have an eight month emergency fund, and I would be putting it in any high yielding savings account. Many of them right now are paying 3%, 3%, three and a half percent, so why not put the money somewhere that you're gonna have to keep forever safe and sound to get you through [01:07:00] no matter what happens, and make 3% on it right now and probably even more as interest rates go up.

[01:07:08] I would not be telling you to go and buy a treasury note where you would lock in the money right now for five or 10 years. If you want a little higher interest rate than what savings accounts can give you, then you could buy a three, six month, nine month, one year treasury. Probably average about four or some percent on that, not having to pay state income tax on it, but I would probably also wait, cuz I think you're gonna see interest rates on treasuries start to come down here now cuz when the dollar gets weaker, which it's doing right now, the stock market goes up, but interest rates then start to come down.

[01:07:50] So I would wait just a little bit for that. But there will come a time again when you could probably get five and a half percent on a 10 year treasury. But I would be doing a [01:08:00] treasury ladder. Now, obviously I don't have enough time right now to tell you exactly what to do, but really on the Women and Money Podcast, I do tell you exactly what to do, how to ladder treasuries, what you should do and what you shouldn't do.

[01:08:16] Remember, most of the advice is geared towards older. You'll be able to decipher it, what makes sense for you or not. , also, you do have exposure in your four plan for what? For the stock market. So it's not like you're not putting money in there every single month. So you have that exposure. Just continue to do that.

[01:08:40] The question is, do you have a 401K or a Roth 401k? Cuz you very well may want a Roth 401k. Again, forget the tax write off cuz if you ever leave that job, then you can do an IRA rollover with it from a [01:09:00] Roth 401K to a Roth IRA. Let it sit there for five years. Obviously you pay taxes on that conversion, so maybe you do it little by little and then in a few years, five years, you can have access to all that money that you converted and paid taxes on without any penalties whatsoever. So that may be able a way to give you access to the money that was in your 401k down the road for you to do something else with just saying. 

[01:09:34] Hala Taha: Perfect. I advised that you guys rewind that part back.

[01:09:38] Take some notes. Also, make sure you check out the Women in Money podcast. It is a great podcast. I've been binge listening and I'm in my thirties and I relate to a lot of the stuff that you talk about on that podcast. One last practical question and then we're gonna close it out. I wanna talk about student loan debt because we did touch on everything else except for student loan debt, and I know that pretty recently there's been some news in this [01:10:00] area.

[01:10:00] So a lot of people were excited. They put out their applications on October 14th. Now everything seems to be paused. We don't know which way it's gonna go unless you have an opinion, but what do you think people should do about their student loan debt or how they should approach it right now? 

[01:10:15] Suze Orman: Do you think Suze Orman doesn't have an opinion on almost everything?

[01:10:20] Of course I do. So they're trying to stop it and they're trying to stop it, and right now the stoppage is under appeal. Some judge is letting a verdict that was overruling stopping it go to appeal. They're saying that it damages us. You have to have a complaint that says it damages me. If this goes through, nobody can prove how it damages them.

[01:10:48] So this will go through, in my opinion. So all of you should apply. For those of you who already during the pandemic paid off $10,000 [01:11:00] or more of your student loan debt, you should reapply just to get $10,000 back because you can. Because I think that will happen. So let's make hope. Let's all pray that it happens before January when the moratorium goes away and you may have to start paying again on your student loans, especially if you owe more than $10,000.

[01:11:27] But I think in the long run it will pass, and I hope it does shame on any politician or anybody out there who doesn't want it to pass. How dare they play politics with the lives of all of these people who are under such student loan debt? It's not even funny. . 

[01:11:51] Hala Taha: Yeah. Especially because they followed society.

[01:11:53] They thought If I go to college, I'll get a good job and then I'll be able to pay this back. But things didn't work out that way, so I totally agree. [01:12:00] And you have nothing to lose, so make sure you do apply for that student loan relief. Okay, so let's close this out. Suze, this was such a pleasure. You dropped so much wisdom.

[01:12:09] So I ask a couple questions at the end of the show and then we do something fun at the end of the year. The first one is, what is one actionable thing our young and profits can do today to be more profiting tomorrow? 

[01:12:20] Suze Orman: Start saving in a retirement account, a Roth I IRA or a Roth 401k, 403 B or TSP. If you really wanna have a lot of money 30, 40 years from now, you have got to do that.

[01:12:36] Hala Taha: I'm gonna take heed to that advice, I promise you. And what is your secret to profiting in life?

[01:12:43] Suze Orman: You have to know your own thoughts. You have to know what you think and what you feel and how you want to do something you really wanna profit in life. Then make sure that you have self-worth, you [01:13:00] know who you are.

[01:13:01] And you have faith in who you are and listen to your gut. If your gut tells you, don't do something, don't dare do it. 

[01:13:14] Hala Taha: I love that advice. Thank you so much, Suze. It was such a pleasure. 

[01:13:17] Suze Orman: Thank you, girlfriend. Best of luck to you.

[01:13:25] Hala Taha: That was such a great episode, and I am so excited that I got such a boss, babe Legend like Suze Orman on my podcast. And believe it or not, it's actually really hard for me to get powerful women like her to come on the show, but Suze Orman did and I was hype because my mom is obsessed with her and she is so sharp.

[01:13:47] We had the goat of Personal finance on the show, the greatest Ever to do it right here on Young and Profiting Podcast, and I have to say, Suze is a ball of fire. She's got so much energy. She [01:14:00] made me feel like I need to get more sleep and like I need a Red Bull Ivy drip to keep up with her and she's got an inspiring rags to richest story.

[01:14:09] I think my favorite part of this interview was just learning about her story. I had no idea what she went through to get to where she is and how she got into it later in life. It's so interesting and so inspiring, and I think there's so many lessons to unpack here besides her financial advice.

[01:14:25] So that's what I'm gonna spend time on the outro is just recapping some of my big learnings in terms of her story. Number one, you are not your past. You have the power to change your identity. Suze went from a college dropout and a person who was terrible at school and not taken seriously, and she was a waitress.

[01:14:48] And then she became the most recognized financial expert in America. Talk about a major transformation. You are not your past young and profiteers. You have the capability to change. You do [01:15:00] not need to be shackled by your past. Number two, your greatest weakness is also your greatest strength. Suze had a learning disability and a speech impediment that hindered her reading abilities.

[01:15:12] But on the flip side, that helped her hone in on the skills she's known for today. She's an exceptional speaker and she's amazing at numbers, and that's how she makes millions now. Number three, you're never too old to learn something new. Suze did a 360 career change at age 30 and then dominated her field within a handful of years.

[01:15:32] And by the way, young and profiteers, I pretty much did the same thing. I was in corporate and I thought I would never get back on a mic. And right around the time that I turned 30, I started this podcast. Look where we are now. Number one, entrepreneurship podcast across all apps. They call me the podcast Princess.

[01:15:50] I am dominating my industry. You were never too old. And in fact, sometimes it's better to approach something new with more wisdom. [01:16:00] Number four, being unique is your superpower. Suze was the only female stockbroker at Merrill Lynch when she started. She wasn't hanging seriously. She was made fun of for what she looked like and what she dressed but then her differences as an outspoken, strong female figure made her heart to ignore and she literally became a national phenomenon.

[01:16:20] If that's not inspiring, I don't know what is YAP fam. I hope you guys feel uplifted and inspired and like you can run through a brick wall. Thanks for listening to another incredible episode of Young and Profiting Podcast, and if you listen, learned and profited from this episode, share it with your friends and family.

[01:16:36] Drop us a five star review on Apple. If you wanna thank us at YAP Media for putting out this free content, that's the number one way to thank us. If you guys enjoyed this episode and you wanna let me know any of your main takeaways, go ahead and direct message me on Instagram or TikTok at yapwithhala.

[01:16:53] Or you can find me on LinkedIn. I'm really hard to miss there. Just search for my name. It's Hala Taha. Thanks so much to our YAP [01:17:00] production team and all your hard work putting on the show. We are crushing the charts right now and your hard work shows. This is your podcast, princess Hala Taha, signing off.